You know who you are, and you owe an apology!

by ChitownDenny, Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 11:50:02 AM EST

As a contributor of thoughts and ideas to this site, I embrace thoughts and ideas that enlarge my scope of knowledge.  I have learned, to my detriment, that getting the information I require to be informed is not accomplished solely from our MSM.  MyDD, and the blogosphere, play a signifcant role in my ability to get thoughts and ideas that contribute to my undersanding of our world.  

Understanding the value of additonal resources for thoughts and ideas, I took umbrage at the level of "discontent" many displayed toward a diarist who wrote the following post:

http://www.mydd.com/story/2008/7/26/1456 48/849

more...

As it turns out, those "dissenters" now have egg on their face.

The publication of Barack Obama's secret prayer at the Wailing Wall in Jerusalem was a scandal in Israel and around the world.  However, it turns out "Obama submitted a copy of the note to media outlets when he left his hotel in Jerusalem."

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/tim-graham/ 2008/07/29/obama-publicized-his-own-secr et-prayer-wailing-wall

This isn't a "gotcha" moment for those who have documented their inability to engage is constructive discourse.  Hopefully, this will serve as a notice that there is a benefit to thoughts and ideas, even those that may be different than our own.

P.S.  I have no personal relationship with the diarist referenced, nor any contributor on this site, other than recognizing a user id now and then.




Tags: discourse (all tags)

Display:
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Right back at ya, Denny (2.00 / 3)

http://www.prospect.org/csnc/blogs/tappe d_archive?month=07&year=2008&bas e_name=obama_didnt_release_the_note_h

This issue is, at least, still in dispute.


by NewOaklandDem on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 11:53:04 AM EST

Not even in dispute. (1.66 / 6)

Denny and Linfar are just pushing rightwing/PUMA (two heads of the same coin really) lies.

If they had any shame, they'd publicly apologize for their crap.


by Geekesque on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:59:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not even in dispute. (1.60 / 5)

Geek--No you would apologize for pushing ill will and animosity on this site. You have no shame at all. And apparently no integrity.


by linfar on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:57:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Where did I push a falsehood? (2.00 / 5)

When you post FALSE, rightwing smears about the Democratic nominee, you are going to get some very intense pushback.

Don't like it?  Don't spread rightwing trash smears next time.  


by Geekesque on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:03:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Where did I push a falsehood? (none / 0)

It doesn't work like that, Geeksque.

Your words are your responsibility - don't hand that off to anyone else. Insults never help a situation.


by Falsehood on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:23:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Huh? I'm not ducking my own (2.00 / 3)

words.

I'm outspoken in condemning people who come in here and vomit up rightwing fabrications.  


by Geekesque on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:27:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 2)

I'm on my way out.  Be back later this afternoon.  Have at it.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 11:53:45 AM EST

They had at it, and you didn't come out well (2.00 / 1)

It was clear YESTERDAY that this statement wasn't an accurate representation of what Maariv was saying.

The issue is not gray - you demanded an apology on grounds which have now been completely debunked.

Besides which, the same statement Newsbusters cites says that publication was ok because Obama isn't a Jew...

In your rush to show us wrong, you failed to do your research. I'm sorry for all the people who read the lie because of that.


by Falsehood on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:32:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They had at it, and you didn't come out well (2.00 / 1)

Thank you.  You demonstrate that the issue is gray.  It will be a talking point.  You may dispute the talking point, that's discourse.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:45:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They had at it, and you didn't come out well (2.00 / 2)

This is no more a 'talking point' about Obama...than is bringing up Vince Foster is a 'talking point' about Hillary. BOTH of which should be scoffed and ridiculed off the site when they are brought up.

The only ones for whom it will be a talking point will be those who are intent on seeing Obama defeated in November. This is a site committed to seeing the Democratic Candidate elected...therefore...such 'talking points' have no place here.


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:49:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They had at it, and you didn't come out well (none / 0)

It is out there as a talking point.  If your issue is with the talking point, fine, go on to the next diary.  But the talking point is not negative, except for the spin:

"Well, if Obama really had offered the note to everyone, everyone would have published it, and no one would have been upset. That's exactly what happened when Pope John Paul II visited the Wall in March, 2000, during his historic journey of reconciliation, and publicized the prayer he inserted between the stones."


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:55:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Question: (2.00 / 1)

Why are we even talking about it?

When this broke, it was obviously breaking news from the stolen prayer.  We saw the picture of the note.  Don't you think that it would've been published earlier had he leaked the text beforehand?

Regardless, it's pointless.  If he released the text beforehand, then he wanted people to know what he wrote, it's the same as the Pope releasing the words of his prayer.  If he didn't, it's a matter between Barack, God, and the student that took the prayer.  We don't need to be talking about it with speculation either way.


The pebbles have voted and the avalanche has begun.

President-Elect "That One"

by Dracomicron on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:26:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question: (2.00 / 1)

I was personally outraged at the thought that a private prayer was leaked to the press.  But the idea, in our world of politics, that the prayer was purposefully "leaked", especially given the issues of Barack's "religiosity", I find plausible.  The issue regarding the prayer is intent.  Who had intent?
The other issue is regarding the level of discourse perpetrated upon those who address the issue and its intent.
Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:36:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question: (2.00 / 1)

What "issues of Barack's 'religiosity'" are those now?  I didn't think anyone outside of tinfoil hat conspiracy theorists contests that the man is genuinely faithful.

A kid doing something silly isn't plausable?  What if the intent of Obama was to make a prayer at one of the holiest sites on earth, and the yesheva student's intent was to gain instant noteriety with an impetuous act?  

More to the point, what is YOUR intent in making a big deal of this?  Are you concerned that Obama is too much like the Pope?  Do you worry that he's a master at framing the international discourse regarding his candidacy?  Does the effectivness of his media image keep you up at night, so much that you go through days just thinking about Barack Obama over and over again?

Heavy questions, indeed.


The pebbles have voted and the avalanche has begun.

President-Elect "That One"

by Dracomicron on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:41:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Question: (2.00 / 1)

Someone ( http://www.jewishjournal.com/politics/ar ticle/obamas_note_at_the_western_wall_as ks_for_gods_guidance_200807251/ ) obviously leaked the prayer after stealing the actual note.  If not for the evidence that his note was stolen, if you chose to believe the worst about Obama, fine.  But there is proof that it was not leaked by Obama.  


by Tenafly Viper on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 04:49:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They had at it, and you didn't come out well (none / 0)

Vince Foster to Clinton is as Muslim to Obama.  This will not be a queston on SATs, btw.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:56:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Hillary=Lesbian is the same as (2.00 / 3)

"Obama leaked that prayer."


by Geekesque on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:30:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary=Lesbian is the same as (2.00 / 2)

She's not a lesbian?  Now, I'm voting for the other guy!  You ruined my fantasies.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:44:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They had at it, and you didn't come out well (2.00 / 4)

The only gray here is in my hair. This issue is clear-cut.


"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." Samuel Johnson
by MS01 Indie on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:51:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They had at it, and you didn't come out well (2.00 / 1)

I have, just in the past few months, begun sprouting gray (actually, white) hairs at my temple and in my sideburns. At least for now, I think it is kinda cool.  ;)


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:08:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They had at it, and you didn't come out well (2.00 / 2)

"...I think it is kinda cool.  ;)"

Yeah, just wait...that feeling fades as it starts to take over.

;-)


Obama/Adam West or Bruce Campbell or Lucy Lawless '08
by Purple with Green Stipes and Pink Polka Dots Dem on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:54:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They had at it, and you didn't come out well (2.00 / 3)

Honestly, I don't think I'd mind white/gray hair....as long as I had LOTS of it!!  ;)


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:57:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They had at it, and you didn't come out well (none / 0)

Yes, I've been doubly cursed!  Thanks for reminding about that little fun part also.

I just tell everyone that my hair up top is going beige.


Obama/Adam West or Bruce Campbell or Lucy Lawless '08
by Purple with Green Stipes and Pink Polka Dots Dem on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 06:27:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They had at it, and you didn't come out well (2.00 / 4)

By that standard, saying that Obama is a Martian with a brothel in Alexandria is a "gray" issue because its a talking point that can be disputed.

I'm not interested in the accusations that get thrown around (Obama will raise your taxes, Obama didn't visit troops because he couldn't bring cameras) because they AREN'T TRUE.

Are you so politicized that the only that matters is the potency of the charge, and not the facts behind it?

This has no factual basis. The source your are citing has disavowed the statement, for which there was no supporting evidence, and in fact evidence to the contrary.


by Falsehood on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:54:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

And Really (2.00 / 7)

You quote newsbusters, a known right wing outlet?  You're better than that.


by NewOaklandDem on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 11:53:48 AM EST

Re: And Really (1.80 / 5)

No, this person is not. One source of dubious fiber and a gloating diary cometh. how sad some people can't see through certain people who claim to just be interested in constructive discourse with this tripe!!


by Dog Chains on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 11:56:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Indeed. (2.00 / 1)

Newsbusters is the Newsmax of Newsmax.


"Hey, check it out. You just had yourself a glue OD. So you're learning another lesson. Don't do too much glue, or your night sucks."
by vcalzone on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:08:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 10)

Umm no the paper has now refuted the statement that Obama supplied a copy of the prayer

Eventually, Krieger got a Ma'ariv spokesman on the phone himself and asked about the accusation that Obama had set up the whole story himself. The guy on the other end of the line said

...that the accusation is "completely false," and that he has no idea who these papers were quoting from Ma'ariv. "No official spokesman for Ma'ariv told this to any of the papers."


Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that there is no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy on the proof.
by jsfox on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 11:58:03 AM EST

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 5)

The problem is the link you give is to a text which quotes Maariv's response. Basically Maariv says that Obama authorized the publication and in any case it didn't matter since it was not a jew's prayer.

I personally consider that the second half of Maariv's argumentation completely discredits the first. If you have no other source, this is not news... I've read Maariv's response several days ago.
This provides no new evidence.


by french imp on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 11:58:44 AM EST

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 7)

Seems your debunker diary has been debunked.


by rfahey22 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 11:59:32 AM EST

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 9)

Then there is this - http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank /archive/2008/07/29/obama-vindicated.asp x


"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." Samuel Johnson
by MS01 Indie on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:00:28 PM EST

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 10)

Denny, now that you have egg on your face will you apologize to those you said should apologize?


"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." Samuel Johnson
by MS01 Indie on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:02:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 1)

I'm still trying to get out to the health club.  As I commented below, you document, along with me, the issue is gray, not black and white.  You may choose to dispute the message or you may shoot the messenger.  Nevermind, you've demonstrated your intent.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:07:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 7)

yes, you post a lie that is verified by a site known for posting these lies about progressives but it's our intent that should be questioned on a progressive sight. Have you NO SHAME sir?


by Dog Chains on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:09:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 5)

My 'intent' was to show that even the conservative media that pounced on this has already backed off. The newspaper itself has denied any connection to the claim you put forward also. For pete's sake, my link was to an article on the New Republic. If they have debunked this then there certainly isn't any gray area here. They would be all over it if they thought there was the least little possibility that there was any truth here.


"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." Samuel Johnson
by MS01 Indie on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:12:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 1)

And my point still remains (regardless of the accurate news put out by the MSM, the politicking of this issue), do you shoot the messenger for her thoughts or dispute the message.  It is obvious the point brought up in that diary is plausible, if not likely.  This diary makes no judgement to the issue of the publication of the prayer.  It make an issue of the level of discurse.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:18:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I do both (2.00 / 7)

Anyone who comes to a Democratic blog to repeat Republican lies about Obama deserves a ration of shit for it.  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:22:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I do both (none / 0)

Uh, no, YOU don't.  Your user id is also recognizable.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:25:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Huh? (2.00 / 3)

All the shit Linfar got for posting that lie about Obama was deserved.  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:29:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I do both (2.00 / 4)

Denny, you have just discounted accuracy and are staking your claim on someone else proving the false nature of something you can't prove.  Back away from the keyboard and don't do stupid stuff. It catches up to you.


by niksder on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 04:02:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 3)

It is no more 'plausible' than 'Obama REALLY wrote a note to Satan but it was switched, by a cunning Axelrod, out of the Wailing Wall before the yeshive student could retrieve it.'

The validity of the point in this diary, and the one it references, is not merely 'not likely'...it's absolute balderdash. And, as such, said point deserves the derision it receives/d (though, the vitriol tossed out at the diarists herself/himself is uncalled for).


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:25:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 1)

The message vs. the messenger.  That's my point.  And frankly, the diarist to whom I refer is not the first or only to express the conundrum.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:49:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 2)

But when the message is demonstrably a steaming pile of shit, shouldn't the messenger be made aware of what that smelly brown pile of goo he's holding is? And once made aware, shouldn't he drop it and go wash his freakin hands?  


by vadasz on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 05:11:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (1.33 / 3)

Wow!! someone sticking up for the level of discourse on this website and for being able to write about thoughts without getting verbally assaulted. You restore my willingness to keep going.


by linfar on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:02:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 1)

Is that by any chance a mental health club?

Cause you got some issues you need to work out.

snark


by BlueinColorado on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:47:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 7)

So does that mean ChitownDenny owes an apology for writing this diary?


by JBGolden on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:02:29 PM EST

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 7)

The title quickly became ironically prophetic.


by TCQuad on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:18:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Dishonest, shameless people (2.00 / 4)

never feel obliged to apologize.


by Geekesque on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:53:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dishonest, shameless people (1.50 / 4)

Geek--I guess you would know all about that.


by linfar on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:03:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Name one lie I've pushed while (2.00 / 4)

posting here.


by Geekesque on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:03:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (1.75 / 4)

And I am the person I believe who is owed an apology from everyone who trashed my diary with outrage over my saying on Sunday I believe information  about the prayer  was deliberately leaked/arranged/whatever word you want to use. And I damn well want the apology from all those who just could not believe how outrageous my assertion was, who accused me of being disloyal, a freeper and on and on and on!!!!!!!!!!!!


by linfar on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:04:35 PM EST

Never!!! (1.75 / 4)

Repeating Republican lies about Obama is a disloyal thing to do.  You should have known better.  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:07:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Never!!! (1.66 / 3)

anytime, someone write a diary critical of Obama you call them Republicans. You are not helping democracy. If I can't give feedback, both positive and negative about a candidate, we are in trouble here.


by linfar on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:04:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Never!!! (1.00 / 2)

DFTT


Another Clintonista against John McCain
by psychodrew on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 03:08:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Oh puhleez! (2.00 / 4)

You lied about Obama's prayer.  That isn't feedback it is lying.  

Please don't ask me to pretend you don't know the difference.


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 03:34:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

untrue, but sadly, par for the course for you.. (2.00 / 1)

anytime, someone write a diary critical of Obama you call them Republicans.

This is untrue.

We call them republicans when they lie while doing it. If you want to take issue with something that he has actually done, then go ahead. It's when you lie and slander in order to be "critical" that people take offense.


If you are not voting Obama, please let me know so I can replace your sorry ass with another new voter.
by Darknesse on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 06:54:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who (2.00 / 9)

I did not call you names and I would not have done so.  I am sorry that anyone did.

That being said, the accusation that he leaked intentionally has since been debunked.  More importantly that accusation was completely absurd in the first place.


by Reaper0Bot0 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:07:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who (2.00 / 1)

Stop your sucking up;) Since this is a troll diary, I'm going to comment it on up


by Dog Chains on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:10:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 3)

Didn't you read the links commenters posted showing that Denny's source has already been debunked?


"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." Samuel Johnson
by MS01 Indie on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:08:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 2)

PUMA's can't be bothered by facts.


by Dog Chains on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:11:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 2)

I may not always (or often, for that matter) agree with her...but, linfar is not a PUMA.


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:12:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (none / 0)

The rant she is referencing with this comment makes me wonder. Her diary was atrocious in it's visciousness


by Dog Chains on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:15:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 2)

Thoughts and ideas that differ from yours do not make them atrocious or vicious.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:30:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who (2.00 / 4)

So if I were to accuse you of something like this it would be okay?  Or more accurately, if I were to pass along a hit-piece from, say, RedState that accused you of it, that would be okay?


by Reaper0Bot0 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:32:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who (none / 0)

The accusations could go both ways, my learned friend.  When you run for office, or I, we will put ourselves in the position you refer to.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:39:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 1)

No, but calling someone a liar, a panderer and stating you're embarrassed by them does. but then again, i don't come to progressive sites posting fringe uber right garbage saying it proves me right, so I can see where you and I differ, junior


by Dog Chains on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:33:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (1.60 / 5)

Oh yes, and this memo that he tried to commit a fradulent act and cover it up, that's not atrocious either little on, let me know if you ever decide to let go of your irrationality to actually excercise any type of real discourse you so desperately crave


by Dog Chains on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:39:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 1)

I will not hide rate you back, your diary alone proves what a piece of garbage, lying troll you are


by Dog Chains on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:53:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 2)

You are my hero :) Not your intention of course. But sometimes, it is just so sweet to have someone stand up for free speech, especially when you are the one people are wanting to silence--all because they don't agree with you--or you make them uncomfortable.


by linfar on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:06:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Enough with the free speech crap, please (1.75 / 4)

No one is suggesting you don't have the right to peddle your lies about Obama.  What we are suggesting is that you don't peddle your lies here.  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:11:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 4)

You abused free speech Linfar

ERGO

We're free to use our speech to abuse your abuse

Get it now?


by duende on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 05:06:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You deserve nothing but contempt (1.50 / 8)

for peddling that lie.

Kiss my ass.


by Geekesque on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:53:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You deserve nothing but contempt (1.75 / 4)

I would except you have all these little boils on it from sliming so many, so often and so unfairly. I expect before much longer you won't even be able to sit down.


by linfar on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:07:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You deserve nothing but contempt (none / 0)

...from sliming so many, so often and so unfairly.

If that's not the pot calling the kettle black, I don't know what is.


If you are not voting Obama, please let me know so I can replace your sorry ass with another new voter.
by Darknesse on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 06:57:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (none / 0)

So, you document, along with me, the issue is indeed gray, not black and white.  Attack the messenger or attack the message?


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:04:44 PM EST

You're in a hole (2.00 / 6)

Just stop digging.


by JJE on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:11:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 3)

Rush Limabaugh says Democrats are dumb, and evil, does this mean there's gray area too, yippeeeeee!!!! Hooray for straw man arguments


by Dog Chains on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:12:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 5)

Actually, some issues are black and white. For instance, Obama either leaked the note or he didn't. Right now all the credible news sources seem to be saying that he didn't.


by Cincinnatus on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:26:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

No, it's crystal clear. (2.00 / 3)

You're just trying to enable rightwing/PUMA lies.


by Geekesque on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:52:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 4)

Hey ChiDenny..
Do You prefer the egg on your face over easy?

However,; you have revealed a source for your news.
So keep those GOP talking points coming...


"harlequin speech of suicide, demanding instantaneous lobotomy"
by nogo postal on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:06:57 PM EST

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 1)

I think we should shame-rec this diary to the top of the rec list. Denny won't only have a little egg on his face, he'll be buried in eggs.


"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." Samuel Johnson
by MS01 Indie on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:18:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 1)

I love KA-YA-NA.  It is an omelette of feta, tomatoes, and onions.  


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:22:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 3)

I like a western omelet or a nice cheese soufflé.  


"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." Samuel Johnson
by MS01 Indie on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:25:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (none / 0)

We may be sayig the same thing.  We like omelettes.  Or we may be saying different things.  We like different omelettes.  Either way, we're engaged in the discourse.  The whole point of this diary!


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:28:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 4)

That actually sounds hella good.


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:28:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 1)

WTF?
ChiTown...are you smoking crack?
I say that your omelette sounds hella good and you HR me?

Seriously, unless you have had one crazy streak of a shaky ratings finger....you are most definitely abusing the system.


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:00:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 1)

Peace.  I swear I mojo'd.  It's the computer, not the user (hmm, mesaage, not the messanger).
But seriously, I mojo'd.  Fixed, now.
Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:16:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 3)

I was hoping it was in error....because, really, it sounds hella good!

Seriously though, I know how crazy easy it is to slip up with the ratings...that is why I pretty much ignore TRs outright, and with HRs I try to get clarification.

No worries.


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:22:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Dude (1.00 / 8)

You are such a complete fucking loser.


The sharpest criticism often goes hand in hand with the deepest idealism and love of country. ~RFK
by Vox Populi on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:09:08 PM EST

Re: Dude (none / 0)

tonedevil, YOU abuse the rating system!


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:34:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Don't attack the messenger!! (2.00 / 8)

There is a lot of evidence to support Vox Populi's point.  What is wrong with having a dialog about it?  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:38:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Don't attack the messenger!! (1.66 / 6)

Exactly, what happened to "don't shoot the messenger"?  Isn't being a loser just "grey area"?

;)


I'm as strong as a bull moose, and you can use me to the limit. - Teddy Roosevelt
by fogiv on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:04:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Don't attack the messenger!! (none / 0)

mojo-ing this statement "You are such a complete fucking loser", which deserves HR, is an abuse.  Please don't embarass yourself.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:11:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Don't attack the messenger!! (2.00 / 1)

No chitown. Calling you a fucking liar is completely accurate at this point, especially since you won't retract and pusillanimously talk about 'grey areas'.

You've embarassed yourself in my eyes. It will be a long time before I believe anything you write.

And though you might not be behind that 777 site

You might as well be.


by duende on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 04:59:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

And, (1.66 / 6)

you, ChitownDenny, abuse the diary system.


by tonedevil on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:43:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 3)

If he did release that note, it rather undermines the accusation of craven scheming being tossed around.  If he offered it, it loses the 'guarantee' of authenticity that it's privacy would bestow.  But it also makes the idea that Axelrod paid someone to pluck it out that much more ridiculous.  It was a lovely, if a bit banal note.  

As someone who has placed notes in that very place, I can't say it's much different in content and genre than I assume most others contain.  Some may express more specific for healing or fertility.  Some may appeal for divine assistance in financial matters.  But very few if any will read 'Please God, make me King of the World,' or 'Please help me score with Ilana tonight.'


The future is unwritten
by Strummerson on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:13:14 PM EST

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 2)

If the note had been 'planted'....I would have expected to see something along of 'Please ,God,  Continue to Bless The United States of America...', or something of the like. If they were gonna plant it...you'd think they'd make sure to get in the one 'blurb' that would garner the most 'positive' attention.


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:19:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 2)

Indeed.  But my point here is that if he really gave it to the press, the planting argument is even further discredited.


The future is unwritten
by Strummerson on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:21:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, and you owe an apology! (2.00 / 3)

and Denny don't forget to write a diary citing this current Newsbusters headline

'"People' Interview: Michelle O Brags On Her Smarts"

Newsbusters?
..
Chitown..you know that in the future when you post you may be asked if Newsbusters was your source..


"harlequin speech of suicide, demanding instantaneous lobotomy"
by nogo postal on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:16:24 PM EST

Re: You know who you are, (2.00 / 4)

I just wanted to make something of a meta comment: my prediction is that this "truthy" story about Obama will stay up the rest of the day (as it should - I think it's factually wrong, as shown by the various links upthread, but it is not banworthy), however diaries about Edwards's issues - which probably are a little "truthier" - have been deleted within an hour or two.  Strange, that.


by rfahey22 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:20:52 PM EST

Re: You know who you are, (2.00 / 5)

I am still enraged that my non-troll diary on the Edwards flap was deleted within 20 minutes yet I've seen flat-out troll diaries last for hours on end.


by Reaper0Bot0 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:22:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You know who you are, (2.00 / 2)

Indeed, that was odd.  Your diary wasn't trollish in the least.


I'm as strong as a bull moose, and you can use me to the limit. - Teddy Roosevelt
by fogiv on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:07:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You owe the apology. (2.00 / 3)

If you don't apologize for spreading lies, one can only conclude that you're a rightwing Republican bootlicking troll.


by Geekesque on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:51:00 PM EST

This is a non-issue, IMO (none / 0)

A. Either Obama is a refreshingly naive candidate who thinks that he can leave a note to God without anyone looking at it or publishing it.

or

B. Obama and his campaign wanted it to be published, therefore he created a very nice note to God.

I don't see anything wrong with either situation. This is IMO...of course.


by soyousay on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:51:36 PM EST

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 7)

Uh, speaking as a Jew, it's a really big deal that some yeshiva student would do this.  Prayers placed in the wall are not for human eyes.  I cannot remember this ever happening before!  Naive?  WTF?


by Reaper0Bot0 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 12:55:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 2)

Seriously...persons with far more fame and recognition have left their prayers without having them stolen and put into print. World leaders, Religious leaders, Royalty, Actors, Musicians....NONE of them wound up having theirs stolen. One is not naive IN THE LEAST to believe that, at such a respected holy site, a prayer would be safe.

It is frustrating for me that people just don't get that. IT NEVER HAPPENS. No matter how 'famous' the individual is. NEVER.

To push the bullshit talking point of 'he should have expected it' or 'he planned for it to be leaked' is to show blatant ignorance of the history, respect and tradition that surrounds The Wailing Wall.

This is the type of bullshit that should only find a home at RedState others of the same ilk.
Shameful that it has found an audience, albeit a VERY small one, here on MYDD.


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:22:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 1)

'he should have expected it'

...and I believe he did. The note was pretty general IMO. A non-issue.
by soyousay on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:28:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 4)

Ok, so if you believe the bullshit...please explain why, exactly, he should have 'expected it'? Why should one expect something that NEVER HAPPENS?

What other crazy bullshit do you believe?


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:31:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 1)

Because Obama is running for president of the United States. Everything he says and does is scrutinized by the media and by the American people and the world for that matter. Same goes for McCain.

If you don't think so then you're naive IMO.


by soyousay on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:35:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 2)

Your ignorance of the subject is staggering, and it is obvious that you are content to remain ignorant.
IMO, you are trolling this thread with the sole intent of stirring division.
You've succeeded, to a degree, but, I (for one) have learned that you are one to ignore.
I shall start now.
by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:39:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (1.50 / 4)

Your ignorance of the subject is staggering, and it is obvious that you are content to remain ignorant.
Do you receive points for insulting those that you disagree with?
IMO, you are trolling this thread with the sole intent of stirring division.
I call this situation a non-issue and you consider that trolling? That's just so, so....sensitive. :D

That's just too funny. I didn't say one thing negative about Obama and you're still insulted.


by soyousay on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:52:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 2)

Hi soyousay :)  You have said exactly what I said. Anyone who won't consider the idea that the Obama campaign at the very least planned for a leak--is beyond naive. They are dangerous :) :)


by linfar on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:10:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 2)

People didn't complain about your comments because you said you thought the Obama campaign probably planned on the possibility of a leak. You implied the Obama campaign orchestrated the leak. You compared it to Reagan giving a prepared speech in which he claimed to be speaking off the cuff. There is a difference, even if you can't see it.


"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." Samuel Johnson
by MS01 Indie on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:44:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 1)

HR, Chitown?
Interesting.

If it is not accidental...I will have to remember how sensitive you are to bullshit and lies being called out for what they are when next I comment in a diary of yours.

If it is accidental...no worries, move along..nothing to see here...


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:55:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (none / 0)

Upon reflection, I will say I misread your comment to use a four-letter type word toward the commenter; it was in fact a four-letter type word used toward the commenter's thought.  My understanding is, that is within the rules, so I have removed the HR.  Good job with the discourse, though.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:04:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 1)

That's all fine and dandy, I am done 'discoursing' with that individual anyways.....but what about your hella good omelette? How on earth is that HR worthy?


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:07:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 1)

Dude, I mojo'd you on that!  It is delicious.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:12:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (none / 0)

kysen, I don't think your comments on this diary or on mine, do you proud. You were outraged at the very idea the prayer was leaked. Now you want to shout down someone who says, 'yeah, other people think it was leaked' C'mon. You aren't a true believer, in the worst sense of that word, are you?


by linfar on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:13:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 1)

Frankly, I am not overly concerned with how proud anyone here is of me.

No, I was not 'outraged at the very idea that the prayer was leaked'....in fact, I did not even comment in your diary about it. I found the idea ridiculous and without merit, but I was not 'outraged' about it. Very little 'outrages' me n RL....and virtually nothing someone says on a blog does.

While I found the idea itself ridiculous, it was the pushing of the 'theory' after it had been proven false that I find beyond the pale, and more fitting of the tripe spewed on sites FAR to the Right of MYDD.

Seriously, this ranks right up there with the scurrilous attacks on Clinton concerning Vince Foster. Absolute falsehoods that have no place on a Democratic site....lies that do not deserve to be 'discussed' as though they have merit. Like someone here on the thread said....where is the line drawn? Should we engage Holocaust deniers in civil conversation because their 'theory' is 'plausible'. I think not.

So, yeah, ya don't like my comments in this thread? Fine. I don't like much of what you write...but, I don't expect you are writing with the purpose of making me proud of you so I don't bother commenting on it.

You are in the wrong for spreading the bullshit.
Others are in the wrong for coming down on you too much on a personal level.

Me? I've done neither.
And for that....I'M proud of me, regardless as to whether you or anyone else is as well.

Big picture, you are not the innocent victim here..and it does not put you in a flattering light to play one. Though, admittedly, you may be equally concerned about being flattering as I am about making others proud of me.

C'est la vie.


by Kysen on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 02:36:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (none / 0)

Ok, so if you believe the bullshit...please explain why, exactly, he should have 'expected it'? Why should one expect something that NEVER HAPPENS?
What other crazy bullshit do you believe?

The next time Obama shoots a jumper and falls upward into space, he should have expected it.


If you are not voting Obama, please let me know so I can replace your sorry ass with another new voter.
by Darknesse on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 07:02:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (2.00 / 1)

IMO your "O" tends to be wildly inaccurate more often than not.  SoIsay.


I'm as strong as a bull moose, and you can use me to the limit. - Teddy Roosevelt
by fogiv on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:09:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is a non-issue, IMO (1.00 / 2)

So you're saying this is an issue? Where's the outrage? :D Give me a break.


by soyousay on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 01:25:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Idle Thoughts and observations. (2.00 / 4)

Ok, this is gonna be somewhat long and rambling, but I feel like it's something I wanna throw out.

I actually understand what you were going for, Chitown. The problem is is that you went about it entirely the wrong way. If it would've just about wanting people to apologize for how they treated the other diarist it would've been better. But when